Permanent Queens – Why all the hate? by Skidfoot

Skidfoot wonders why permanent queens are not as loved as those who returned to their warrior duties.

Art by Cat-Patrisiya

2 years ago, on the Warriors Wiki, I posted a blog about permanent queens. For those of you who don’t know, a permanent queen is basically just a she-cat who decides to stay in the nursery and care for kits instead of going back to warriorhood. I’m pretty sure most people already know that but hey, might as well say it anyway.

I decided to share (and edit) my 2-year-old post here, because I still really like it. Without further ado, here it is.

I’ve always been so irritated about people saying that permanent queens, mostly Daisy and Ferncloud are useless. And my question is… why? Admittedly, I used to think they were useless as well, but honestly, I can’t judge. Yes, Daisy was very paranoid, and complained a lot. Yes, Ferncloud spent more time as a nursery queen than a warrior. No, neither of them are useless, and I’m very ticked off at the fact that Ferncloud was killed off because of fan demand. I really wish that she didn’t die, only because fans wanted her to die. However, it makes a little bit of sense because she was in series one and would have been pretty old by now. At least she’s in StarClan with Dustpelt now.

Here are the common reasons I usually see/hear of when people express hatred for at least one permanent queen.

Laziness/Uselessness – One reason why people would hate permanent queens is because they say the queens are lazy. All they do is lay around and “pretend” to take care of kits. Excuse me, do you even know how hard it is to care for mischievous troublemakers? I’m pretty sure a queen doesn’t lay around all day, expecting prey to be delivered to them and allowing her kits to escape camp or annoy elders/warriors. We don’t know what they do on a daily basis. Also, if queens are still pretending to take care of kits, then I’m guessing you call nursing for a queen who can’t produce milk “pretending.” If there were no permanent queens and a currently nursing queen couldn’t produce milk, guess what? One of two things will probably happen. The kit will die, possibly before it can even open its eyes, or, two Clans will have to make a huge decision of either a queen from a different Clan moves to the Clan with the kit(s) that needs milk which’ll make the kit think that the queen from the rival Clan is their mother, or the kit moves to the Clan temporarily and the biological mother has a huge risk of losing her kit because the kit will believe it is from the rival Clan.

Kit-machine – This is mostly directed on Ferncloud. I’ve heard that she’s a useless/bad queen/character because she’s a “kit machine.” I don’t get it. She’s considered a kit machine because she gave birth thrice. Why is she the only kit machine? Robinwing gave birth to three litters and nobody batted an eye, probably because she wasn’t a permanent queen. And then Ferncloud gave birth to seven kits, almost half (Because there can never be a half-kit) of which died before warriorhood and she’s hated on for it. Sorreltail gives birth to two litters/six kits in which only one dies before warriorhood and she’s loved. Don’t get me wrong, I like Sorreltail very much, but I don’t see why Ferncloud is bad for having nearly the same amount as Sorreltail. It’s a one kit difference. And “kit-machines” are actually good for the Clan. It means more warriors!

Over-protectiveness – I don’t see why people hate any kind of queen for being over-protective. It’s how all queens act, so why are they disliked for it? Should the queen just let her kit wander outside camp and get risk being eaten by a fox, snake, or badger? No! It’s better to be over-protective instead of not being protective of your kit at all. Plus, isn’t it common for mothers and fathers nervous about their children fighting their first battle? After all, battles are like a deck of cards. You don’t know what you’ll get. In this case, one of three possibilities: Ruffled up, badly wounded, or death. It’s painful to see your child go into their first battle, where they risk being killed. And before anyone says that they are so overprotective that they want to basically pamper their kits in lieu of letting them fight for their Clan, I believe that the kits’ll probably be old enough to tell their parents how they feel about being pampered.

So, to conclude, I’m pretty sure permanent queens are not a waste of time and space or are kit-machines. They are there to service their Clans. Yes, they should be a bit more participative, but we don’t know what they do on a regular basis. Besides, they’re technically like the cat-versions of stay-at-home moms. You wouldn’t give a stay-at-home mom (or dad) mouse-dung, would you? Also, if you disagree with anything I said above, please be respectful. The last thing I need is cranky users getting mad at my opinion!

Many thanks!

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33 comments

  • I’ve always liked Ferncloud, not Daisy as much, but I wouldn’t say any permanent queens were useless or bad characters. You did an amazing job explaining your reasons why permanent queens are great. Thumbs up.

  • Amazing article, Skidfoot!!! This was very well done and your points were explained well. I cried when Ferncloud died and I agree that she shouldn’t have died just because of screaming fans who hate her just for having lots of kits, although she would be with Dustpelt in StarClan later when he died. I honestly love both Ferncloud and Daisy. They are good characters and they really shouldn’t deserve the hate that they get.
    Nice job! 👍🏽🙂

  • Amazing article!!!!! I love Ferncloud, and Daisy not as much but she’s okay, and I don’t judge them a lot for being permanent queens. However, I must say that there are no toms who do anything the equivalent of a permanent queen, and sometimes I get the sexism vibe – okay, not that much, but if there are permanent queens then why not something similar for males?

    Ferncloud died a warrior. She just chose to stay in the nursery because of all of her litters. Daisy didn’t want to train as a warrior and I respect that.

  • Saying a permanent queen is useless is ignoring how important mothers are. By the time Ferncloud became a permanent queen she’d had two litters and was familiar with the struggles of raising kits.

    Can you imagine how great and useful that is to young queens who are scared and nervous about their kitting? Not to mention it means there’s an extra cat to watch the rambunctious kits and make sure they get the care they deserve.

    Like, let’s think how useful a permanent queen (by choice of course), is to the clan, there is a constant caretaker for the clans kits. Like imagine if when Brokenkit was born, there’d been a caretaker who could give him the care he’d needed at a young age and with foreknowledge of dealing with several litters of kits could know how to handle the situations that started pushing Brokenkit to be what he was. A foster mother who’d love him in the stead of his real mother.

    While that likely would not have completely changed Brokenstars path, it may have altered how things played out in some way. Maybe Brokenstar would’ve at least not endangered kits like he did since he had his caretaker to learn love and caring. Which may not have tempered his ambition and the advantages he got through Raggedstar.

    If there’d been a permanent queen in ThunderClan when Bluefur wanted to become deputy, the queen could’ve stepped up to take care of Bluefur kits so she could focus on her deputy duties. While I don’t think the permanent queen should be a replacement for a mother, she can free up a stronger she cat or if there is a need for more warriors and other queens are able bodied enough, the permanent queen is able to handle the nursery kits.

    There are many advantages of having a permanent queen, especially if they’re a cat like Daisy who just don’t have the temperament for warrior (but will fight if pushed).

  • I agree, Skidfoot! And about the kit-machine thing- Snowbird of ShadowClan also had a lot of kits, and no one complained. I think Ferncloud is awesome, but I’m meh on Daisy. Good article! 😀

  • “Queens are the roots of the clans. Without them the Clans will be easily uprooted.” I may not be exact but I tried to quote from the books.
    I never thought bad of any permanent queens. In fact they are great because the kits they give to the clan, who in turn grow up to be Warriors. Thus, the clans thrive.

  • Thank you so much for writing about this, I agree with just about everything you said. So what if she-cats choose to have lots of kits? Being a mother is a difficult path, and not many people realize that.