What would have happened without Thistleclaw? by Frostwhisker

Frostwhisker wonders what events of the series wouldn’t have happened if Thistleclaw hadn’t been an antagonist.

Art by SEGAmastergirl (Twitter: @SEGAmastergirl)

Hi everyone I hope you had a great day!

The first novella I read was Tigerclaw’s Fury and I think it explained a lot of things to me. So I’ll be exploring what would have happened to the Clans if Thistleclaw had been a normal guy.

This article contains spoilers for like… every Warriors main arc books (especially Omen of the Stars and the Broken Code) and some novellas and Super Editions. So only read if you already know spoilers, aren’t bothered about spoilers or are up to date with the books. You have been warned.

1.Tigerpaw wouldn’t have become bitter

If Tigerpaw had not been upset during his apprenticeship, he may not have grown to be the warrior he was. True, a lot of his evil-ness was influenced by his anger towards his father, but I think the main reason for his anger and bitterness is Thistleclaw.

So, I believe that, without Tigerstar being bitter and evil, many cat’s lives would be spared, including: Redtail, Brindleface, Swiftpaw, Bluestar, Gorsepaw, Runningwind, Stonefur, Graypool, Cinderpelt’s leg, half of Brightheart’s face..I’ve probably missed some but you get the point.

2. The Battle of BloodClan may not have happened.

If Thistleclaw was a normal mentor he wouldn’t have asked Tigerpaw to kill Tiny. This is literally like a teacher asking his student to kill a random lost baby.

This means that Tiny would never have become Scourge. Without this, there would be no Battle with BloodClan, sparing Whitestorm and the lives of many unnamed kittypets who died at Scourge’s claws.

But there is a deeper meaning to this. If the Battle of BloodClan would never happen, would there be any use for the ‘fire alone will save our Clan’ prophecy? If StarClan hadn’t sent the prophecy, would it be probable that Bluestar would let a random kittypet into the Clan?

3. Firestar might not exist.

Because of the theory above, it is probable that Firestar would not exist, because the reason why Bluestar let him join ThunderClan was because she believed that he could be the ‘fire’ that would save her Clan.

So if Firestar had never joined the Clan, many cats would be dead. Yellowfang would have died in that bush without Firepaw being there to discover her. This means that Brokenstar would continue leading in ShadowClan because Yellowfang would not be there to stop him.

Bramblekit would have died in the fire that killed Yellowfang, because Firestar would not have been there to save him.

Without Firestar’s persuasion, Graystripe might also have decided to stay in RiverClan, causing Briarlight, Bumblestripe, Millie and Blossomfall to cease to exist in the Clans.

Half of the Clan would not exist – Leafpool, Squirrelflight, Jay, Lion, Holly, Alderheart, Sparkpelt, Cloudtail, Whitewing, Lilyheart, Snowbush, Dewnose, Ambermoon, Leafshade, Larksong, Honeyfur, Dovewing, Ivypool, Fernsong, Sorrelstripe, Hollytuft, Spotfur, Snaptooth, Flywhisker, Flipclaw, Bristlefrost and Thriftear. (I got most of those names off the internet :P)

4. The Three wouldn’t exist.

Let’s assume that Firestar doesn’t exist, and all the above cats wouldn’t have been born. Without Jayfeather, the Clans may not even exist! It was Jayfeather’s (or Jay Wing’s) casting stone that led the ancients to the mountains. Then Clear Sky and the rest of them journeyed from the mountains to create the Clans!

Breezepelt would probably have suffocated in the fox den during the daylight gathering, Swallowkit, Thistlekit and Sedgekit would have died in the tunnels, Poppyfrost would have died as an apprentice, and there are probably many more cats who might have died without Jayfeather.

Without Dovewing, the cats may have perished in the drought, although there was plenty of rain afterwards. Also, many more cats surely would have been crushed by the falling tree during the storm, killing more than just Longtail.

5. The Great Battle would not have happened.

Tigerstar was the reason the battle happened, because he wanted revenge on Firestar. And how could he get revenge on a cat who ceased to exist? Tigerstar would either be in the elders den during Omen of the Stars (if he was suuuuper old, like, older than Mousefur), or he would be in StarClan.

And even if the Battle did happen, many cats including Hawkfrost and Tigerstar would be fighting for the Clans. Breezepelt might have died before it even happened, as I said above, and Ivypool wouldn’t exist.

6. The Darktail drama wouldn’t have happened.

Without Firestar, SkyClan may not have been restored and wouldn’t exist during A Vision of Shadows. Even if it did, Alderheart wouldn’t be around to find them. This means that Darktail would have no scent trail to follow to the lake, and would not have found them.

This is just an idea, but if Darktail was born after WindClan was driven out, in this AU he wouldn’t even exist. Onewhisker would still be living in that tunnel because Firestar wouldn’t be around to rescue WindClan from exile. If Onewhisker lived there forever, he would never have met Smoke, and Darktail wouldn’t have been born.
If Onewhisker met Smoke before WindClan was driven out, Darktail could still exist in the AU, but he wouldn’t have ever known his father, which would mean he would have no reason to take revenge on the Clans. It is unclear when Darktail was born.

7. The Broken Code drama wouldn’t have happened.

First off, Ashfur couldn’t be in love with Squirrelflight, because she wouldn’t have been born, and Ashfur couldn’t get revenge on Bramblestar, because he would have died in the fire as a kit in Rising Storm. Without Hollyleaf being around, Ashfur would probably still be alive during the Broken Code arc.

Plus, Tawnypelt would never have gone to ShadowClan, which means that Shadowsight wouldn’t exist.

In conclusion, Thistleclaw should stay as he is, because without him, none of the series protagonists would exist, and the Clans may have never been born!

If you stayed until here, I respect you, thank you! I hope you enjoyed.


Fan Articles


  • 1
  • 2

  • windclan would come back starclan would just get someone else to do it. same with skyclan.

  • Avatar 💙I really like Alexander’s friend group in Hamilton💙 (Turtlepaw🐢🐢🐢) says:

    Wow, if Thistleclaw didn’t exist… SO many things wouldn’t happen! :0
    You’ll Be Back

  • great article 🙂
    i think that Tigerstar is the reason cinderpelt died because since she got that injery, she couldn’t get proper battle training

  • Thank you, Thistleclaw, for letting Briarlight, WHO I NAMED MY BLOGCLAN PURRSONA AFTER, exsist. This is the only thing I like about you.

  • Great article, totally random question. Is that Beetlewhisker at the paws of Thistleclaw??